Trading and getting fills with Interactive Brokers

[Guest listolyman]

Mcmatterson, i ran into another bug the other day. After the mobile app update last week i could not logon. Tech support said that the new software could not disconnect my pc connection due to the bug. In the interim they informed me to logoff of my pc when leaving until the bug fix is delivered in the next two weeks.

[cwerdna]

My guess is that you've already been marked as a PDT in that account but since you do have more than 25k it isn't a problem. On OH the same thing would happen, I'd get random messages about trade frequency (often inaccurate) but I had enough assets to meet the requirements. As soon as I dipped below 25k when I transferred money out they were all over me even before I made any further trades. Of course you may be correct and they aren't counting it the same, but unless you're below the 25 k minimum it's just speculation on both are parts ;^)

FWIW, on this subject, a day or two after I wrote the above, the "day trades left" field in TOS changed to 1 and the TD AM web site said "Day trade/round trips: 2 in last 5 days or less". It's moot but I guess there was an update lag.

It does seem like TD AM isn't as strict as IB as to what constitutes PDT.

[Xfanman]

I know someone mentioned this already somewhere but I can't find it, is there any way to ADD to an existing position on IB? I keep getting a warning message that I can't be on opposite sides of a position (which I'm not).

Thanks -- Scott

[Kim]

I know someone mentioned this already somewhere but I can't find it, is there any way to ADD to an existing position on IB? I keep getting a warning message that I can't be on opposite sides of a position (which I'm not).

Thanks -- Scott

Do you have a sell order?

[Xfanman]

Do you have a sell order?

Yes that was it Kim, I cancelled that and added to my ORCL and reset my sell order.

Thanks much....Scott

[cwerdna]

Yes that was it Kim, I cancelled that and added to my ORCL and reset my sell order.

Yeah, it's goofy that IB complains about that. TOS has no problems w/me having buy and sell orders open on the same time on the same trade.

I've found that it's less work to Pause Execution (right click on the order), place your opposing order, then click Transmit.

[Xfanman]

Yeah, it's goofy that IB complains about that. TOS has no problems w/me having buy and sell orders open on the same time on the same trade.

I've found that it's less work to Pause Execution (right click on the order), place your opposing order, then click Transmit.

Thanks I'll try that trick next time!

[Xfanman]

For those of you researching new brokers and/or thinking about switching over to IB (or perhaps just did and you're still learning their platform), IB just released an updated version of their TWS Tours app for the iPad that includes a nice section on Mosaic. I just watched the TWS and Mosaic "tours" and they were very helpful pointing out a couple of customization tips that I hadn't seen yet (TWS is SUPER customizable for those of you that want to pull all the levers behind the curtain). If you have an iOS devise and want to check them out, you can find a link to these here -->

http://www.interactivebrokers.com/en/p.php?f=tradersu&p=tours

and their web based tours here (which I did not find as helpful as the app versions but maybe they've updated them since I last viewed them)-->

http://www.interactivebrokers.com/en/p.php?f=tradersu&p=tours

Enjoy!

[Kelly Park]

Can some IB guru tell me how to chart a multileg trade in IB? I can get stocks and individual options charted and there seems to be a way to chart straddles, spreads, RICS and such, but I haven't been able to figure out how to have multi-leg deals charted.

[cwerdna]

Can some IB guru tell me how to chart a multileg trade in IB? I can get stocks and individual options charted and there seems to be a way to chart straddles, spreads, RICS and such, but I haven't been able to figure out how to have multi-leg deals charted.

I'm assuming you have a separate tab set up for your straddles and strangles (don't need a separate one for each trade). Right click on the row for your straddle/strangle, then select Charts > New Chart > Chart this combo now.

I'm no guru of IB at all. I know how to use little of it (compared to my TOS knowledge).

Edited September 24, 2012 by cwerdna

[Xfanman]

Can some IB guru tell me how to chart a multileg trade in IB? I can get stocks and individual options charted and there seems to be a way to chart straddles, spreads, RICS and such, but I haven't been able to figure out how to have multi-leg deals charted.

Kelly, if you have a chart grouped to your Order Window you can simply chart from your sell LMT order it will chart the combo. I use the 2hr bar chart time frame on the last day to see the activity. Do you use Mosaic or TWS?

[Kelly Park]

As often as I have to do it, you would think I would get used to displaying my ignorance. Alas, no, but I will again anyway.

Kelly, if you have a chart grouped to your Order Window you can simply chart from your sell LMT order it will chart the combo. I use the 2hr bar chart time frame on the last day to see the activity. Do you use Mosaic or TWS?

How do I group my chart to the order window? I open my chart by the icon at the top of the page in TWS.

[Xfanman]

Kelly, right next to your Account Number in the upper right hand corner is a drop down arrow. Click on that and there's a 3 Cube icon that says Group Windows. You can select a group color and group that to a chart (with the same group color) that you want to display your Options Combos too. Also, you can always just right click on the combo (they are listed in the Pending Orders tab if you have a sell order in)and select Charts/New Chart, as CWERDNA mentioned). I use Mosaic mostly but that should work in TWS also.

I should also mention that anytime you click on a symbol or spread etc in the grouped window/chart combination that chart will be updated with the stock/option/spread that you clicked on. You can control all sorts of different combinations with the Group Window scheme. This is probably more functional in Mosaic but I can see how TWS would benefit also.

Edited September 24, 2012 by Xfanman

[Kelly Park]

Thanks, Scott. I got it charted, although I don't think I did it quite the same way you were describing.

[Xfanman]

Thanks, Scott. I got it charted, although I don't think I did it quite the same way you were describing.

Well that's the important thing!

[Xfanman]

Here's my IB Mosaic Desktop if it helps anyone else. I'd still like to see other peoples setups that they find functional for them. This is my option trading setup.

My Options Trader window is in the lower left corner. A double click and it's full sized. I set up all my trades ahead of time by tab and keep the tabs active until the trade closes. Since IB doesn't keep the combo's if the platform is closed and reopened I find this the best way to quickly access the combos before and after an order is placed.

Above that I have an Options Chain window to quickly view options info and the type of directional trades I usually make.

I have 3 large graph windows open that I change content on regularly depending on what's on the table that day. The first one in this example is the LEN Strangle I have on at the moment and usually SPY and whatever else I'm watching that day.

The Mosaic window itself is pretty self explanatory, I use the built in chart window to track other spreads usually and then my portfolio, orders etc.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/28661345/Scotts%20Mosaic%20Desktop.png

[damnu812]

Just curious doe's everyone start out with the web trader platform or tws platform on IB? Im in the process of opening an account with IB and browsed thru the platforms. They are a complete 180 from what I've used before. Be honest I dont like what I see so far. IB recommends new traders use web trader is that what most of you do? Any beginner tips and shortcuts you can advise me on?

[cwerdna]

^^^

I can't say I like most of IB's interface very much. I tried Mosaic very briefly and found it very confusing and busy. It adds a TON of crap (items) to my already overloaded taskbar. I think a lot of the documentation on IB's site is based on TWS, so I've switched to that.

I've never tried their web trader.

[kowski06]

Just curious doe's everyone start out with the web trader platform or tws platform on IB? Im in the process of opening an account with IB and browsed thru the platforms. They are a complete 180 from what I've used before. Be honest I dont like what I see so far. IB recommends new traders use web trader is that what most of you do? Any beginner tips and shortcuts you can advise me on?

When I switch to IB I tried web trader for a few days. I had problems with it, it seamed to freeze up on me, and also wouldn't update prices. Other technical issues with it. I didn't really like it much. Based on what a lot of others on SO have recommended I started using TWS Advanced Order (not Mosaic). It took a little while to get used to it, but it's not too bad once you figure it out.

[damnu812]

ok thanks

[Kelly Park]

On IB, when you chart multi-leg option positions, I'm not sure what exactly is bieng represented by the middle section of the candlestick diagram. IB states it is the "Time Averaged BID (or ASK)". Does anyone know how they determine that?

[Marco]

On IB, when you chart multi-leg option positions, I'm not sure what exactly is bieng represented by the middle section of the candlestick diagram. IB states it is the "Time Averaged BID (or ASK)". Does anyone know how they determine that?

in Edit -> Chart parameters you can change what to show (mid or bid ask) I usually use line charts for that sort of grpah but I think if you pick bid/ask the ends of the cande represent the highest ask and the lowest bid in that candle period (15 mins, 30 mins - whatever you pick) and the 'body of the candle the range of the mid point in that period. I fyou choose mid the body of the candle should represent the change of the mid price in that period and the ends the highest/lowest mid point in that time.

As I said thats an educated guess and I think maybe line charts make more sense for what you want to see here.

m.

[jr1221]

I do love charting my combos but I also wish I understood those bars better.

[Xfanman]

I do love charting my combos but I also wish I understood those bars better.

If you chart with lines you'll just get 2 lines one each representing the bid and ask. If you hover over an individual candle you'll get the time average for the Bid and Time average for the Ask for the 3 minutes (or whatever timeframe you selected) as the body of the bar with the candle wicks being the high Bid and Ask on either end. If that's the same during your timeframe you have a solid candle. Look at ACN on the 2hour/3 minute straddle today. The opening candle goes from a max ask of 10.00 to a min bid of 1.85 at open but the body (average) only represents $2.77 - $2.35, after the first candle it normalizes.

[cwerdna]

Is there a good way to get the overall p/l (profit and loss) for a symbol? Trade Log and selecting all days only goes back a week.

I've poked around a few of the reporting functions before and couldn't find anything, but I didnt look that hard.

Not sure if this has been asked before, but is there a good discussion forum for IB how-to's and UI?

Side note: For people not on IB because they hate the cancel/modify fees, we got notified recently of this:

OPTION CANCELLATION/MODIFICATION FEE REDUCTION

As part of our continued commitment to provide the most cost-effective execution services, Interactive Brokers (IB) will be conducting a test of a software upgrade intended to evaluate the impact of reducing or potentially waiving U.S. option exchange order cancellation and modification fees.

During the test period, which begins November 6th, we will reduce cancel fees by approximately 60% while applying the current execution credits in full and encourage you to use this opportunity to modify and/or cancel orders with these reduced fees in mind. Moving forward, our plan is to further reduce the fees in a measured fashion, and potentially waiving in full, after taking into consideration the overall impact to IB of absorbing these exchange fees. Please note that this waiver applies solely to U.S. option orders and does not apply to U.S. API/CTCI directed stock orders or European option and futures orders.

We appreciate your participation and welcome any feedback you may have regarding this change. Interactive Brokers Customer Service

Edited November 8, 2012 by cwerdna

[Marco]

there is a 'P/L on day' and a 'unrealised P/L' column in the risk navigator. Will only show P/L for open positions though (so if you adjusted a position, like rolled a calendar the P/L is only for the open positions) and not sure what it takes as price to value position (last, bid, ask, mid ? or none of the above) Can show funny P/L's for underlyings with wide bid/offer spreads and combos with many legs - my P/L on RUT IC often looks funny. So you need to learn to ignore some noise around your P/L. Other than that its great

[cwerdna]

Has anyone noticed what seems like a new dialog when running IB's TWS. It looks like it just started in the last day or two. I don't remember seeing this before and am a little apprehensive. It's a "Do you want to run this application?..." dialog with "This application will run with unrestricted access which may put your computer and personal information at risk..." If I Cancel, I of course can't continue.

I'm puzzled at it looks like the last new release was on 11/8/12 and I don't remember seeing this dialog until today. Is my memory faulty? It looks like it's properly signed by IB.

The same behavior occurs on my other machine (which I don't use much w/IB). And the same thing if I try using the previous version (I'm going to http://www.interacti...com/en/main.php and selecting Login > Trader Workstation or Trader Workstation Previous).

[Marco]

yep got the same thing, might also be a new java 'feature' rather than from IB. Didn't really worry me as I 'trust' IB ....

[cwerdna]

yep got the same thing, might also be a new java 'feature' rather than from IB. Didn't really worry me as I 'trust' IB ....

I initiated a chat w/IB and after a bunch of back and forth he advised me to downgrade from Java 7 (I'm on Java 7 update 7) to Java 6 and pointed me to http://ibkb.interact...s.com/node/1976 which is a crap article because I have no idea which security flaw they're referring to and it doesn't even have a date. Below's an excerpt of my chat... I think I'm going open a support ticket anyway and see if CSR/tech support rep roulette yields a better answer...

Brendan P: Okay, that seems to be the case. It is Java 7 that is giving this message. Please check this link on why we advise the use of Java 6:

Brendan P:

http://ibkb.interact...s.com/node/1976

(cwerdna): page is very slow in coming up....

(cwerdna): I ended up going to Google cached version of that page since I'm unable to bring it up on your site.... how old is this article? What flaw are they referring to? Is it possible it's been patched already?

(cwerdna): It has a link to download

http://www.oracle.co...ds-1637595.html

which is JAva 6 update 34, when Java 6 is up to update 37 already...

Brendan P: As per the information I have, there are some issues with Java 7, and if you are experiencing any issue using Java 7, you can uninstall it and install the latest build of Java 6.

(cwerdna): Hmmm... I see. Ok. It would be nice if that article actually references which flaw they're talking about... There are frequently 0-day exploits which are (usually) eventually patched...http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9230644/Unpatched_Java_flaw_hit_in_targeted_attacks_researchers_say affected java 7 update 6 yet

http://www.informati...fresh/240006756

reports that update 7 supposedly fixed the ones being exploited.

(cwerdna): ok... well thanks anyway.

(cwerdna): i guess I'll give it a shot.... on 1 of my my secondary machines, I do need jdk7 on it as I was doing some Java development on it... I guess I can remove it from this Java 7 from this one and try putting on 6...

Brendan P: I understand your concern. If you are using the latest build of Java 7 but do not find any issue and need it for your other work, you can continue using it.

(cwerdna): ok... so are you saying this dialog is a known issue or is sometimes encountered by others using Java 7 w/IB TWS?

Brendan P: We haven't come across this so far. But this could be because most of our customers switched back to Java 6 already.

(cwerdna): I see. Interesting.

(cwerdna): Ok. I will try Java 6 when I get a chance.

I need to take a care of a ton of stuff before I go to sleep and might not have time to muck w/Java and rebooting.

[Marco]

why does this message concern you? TWS is still working with it, do you think there's a security issue using java7 and TWS?

[cwerdna]

why does this message concern you? TWS is still working with it, do you think there's a security issue using java7 and TWS?

My original concern (and still is to some degree) is the possibility of a malicious version of TWS being placed on my machine (possibly not by IB itself but by a 3rd party, possibly unauthorized) and it concerns me due to the elevated permissions it's requesting. The app does appear to be properly signed by IB though...

I just wanted to see if others were getting that dialog.... At least I know it's not just me now. By unauthorized, it could be my machine being infected by something or someone have altered content on IB's side, for instance.

It is curious as to why their app needs unrestricted access. If this dialog is in fact new, then it seems this release of TWS is asking for more permission than before (may not be... might be some goofy change in the Java VM) or it maybe a bug (and inadvertent on the part of IB). A change the VM seems unlikely since I'm on Java 7 update 9 (made typo) that was release in mid-October 2012 (https://blogs.oracle..._7_update_9_and) and I'm pretty sure that it wasn't auto-updated recently. It looks like I installed it ~Oct 18th.

Edited November 27, 2012 by cwerdna

[Marco]

I see, clearly I'm more naiive (or less paranoid ) than you are. If you ever roll back to Java6 let me know if you still get that message.

cheers,

m.

[cwerdna]

Yeah... perhaps less paranoid. I have had to cleanup messes on my parents' computers after my dad's "shot himself in the foot" and installed all sorts of malware and spyware on his machine (e.g. iLivid, Funmoodz, random crap from Cyprus, Malta, etc. that even altered their browser search providers to point to questionable searche engines), that also disabled their anti-virus app.

Had to run multiple legit anti-malware apps (e.g. Spybot Search and Destroy, AdAware, Super Antispyware (looks spammy, but it's legit), Malwarebytes, etc.) Was a HUGE waste of my time (took me over a day, including overnight due to scans taking forever besides them having a slow machine). Long ago, he also infected the OS of another machine.

And... I receive a phishing mails (end up in my spam folder) which come from groups which are looking for financial gain. Brokerages seems like a good target for that (besides banks).

I came to realize how bad the problem was once I read http://www.computerw...s_moment.��They have to basically run their attachments on a virtual machine to look for suspicious behavior. A college classmates works at http://www.fireeye.com/ and described to me at a high level a similar such system that they sell...

Watching the video featured at http://www.symantec....meware-toolkits (from 2009 (!)) might be interesting/insightful. You may want to click on the gear, switch to 720p and then watch in full screen.

Edited November 27, 2012 by cwerdna

[Marco]

ha great, thanks for making me more aware/paranoid. I guess never having had any of the issues you descrive above I'm probably less careful/suspicious with these sort of messges

[cwerdna]

Ok... I downgraded from Java 7 update 9 to Java 6 update 37. The UI is a bit different, but essentially, the same text is there but presented differently. I've never had Java 6 on this machine before (at least not while I've been an IB user). The way Java 6 presents it, it's a lot easier to ignore/miss.

So, with the dialog I put up earlier in post 177... was it something new (appeared in the last few days or last week or so) or has it always been there and I just noticed it today?

To me, the problem remains w/Java 6.

BTW, after seeing how my dad shot himself in the foot w/all that malware and spyware, I've observed he's very susceptible to falling prey to phishing emails and/or clicking on random links in emails from unknown senders.

Side note: The reason why so many places use two-factor identification such as the security code card IB forces you to use (http://www.interactivebrokers.com/en/p.php?f=ibgStrength&p=log-default) is I'm guessing that financial institutions practically need to assume that a % of their customers have malware/spyware and keyloggers on their machines so their accounts (username and password) are compromised and the info's being sent to some nefarious party.

One of my banks issues me http://www.emc.com/security/rsa-securid/rsa-securid-hardware-authenticators.htm#!offerings (model 700). So, even if your password got captured, it's useless because it's constantly changing. Another bank forces you to click your PIN on the screen and there's no way to type it (to get around the keylogger problem).

Edited November 27, 2012 by cwerdna

[cwerdna]

I replied w/my result after downgrading to Java 6 and their response was:

Dear Mr. (my last name),

I have checked this with the corresponding department. We have renewed the Digital Signature certificate due to which you get the prompt. You do not need to worry.

Please check the option "Always trust content from this publisher" and click on Run.

Regards,

Brendan

IB Technical Assistance Center

This isn't the most satisfying response to me...

I did notice that the bulid number is now Build 933.5, Nov 26, 2012 2:44:55 PM. This might explain why the sudden (?) change and lack of mention of the .5 build at http://www.interactivebrokers.com/en/p.php?f=tws&p=n&ib_entity=llc...

[cwerdna]

For those considering IB, they have reduced their cancel/modify fees further. I got this email on 11/20.

OPTION CANCELLATION/MODIFICATION FEE REDUCTION #2

As part of our continued commitment to provide the most cost-effective execution services, Interactive Brokers (IB) is now further reducing the cap on U.S. option exchange order cancellation and modification fees, effective immediately.

This cap will serve to reduce the exchange fees, originally assessed at per contract rates ranging from $2.10 - $0.10 to a maximum of $0.25. This change applies solely to U.S. option orders and does not apply to U.S. API/CTCI directed stock orders or European option and futures orders.

Please refer to the Costs section of our website for further updates as we look for opportunities to reduce this fee further moving forward. Interactive Brokers Customer Service

Edited November 29, 2012 by cwerdna

[tjlocke99]

I'm sorry if I missed this info somewhere else on the site, but does anyone know if there is way to set a stop loss or stop limit on an option spread?

Thanks!

[Marco]

I'm sorry if I missed this info somewhere else on the site, but does anyone know if there is way to set a stop loss or stop limit on an option spread?

Thanks!

add the spread to an option trader or quotelist window, right click, trade-> oder entry and then select STP or STP LMT as order type. Would only use stop for very liquid options with thight spreads though (SPY, GLD) as you will be filled at bid/offer - not fun if the spread is huge and you could trade near mid

[tjlocke99]

add the spread to an option trader or quotelist window, right click, trade-> oder entry and then select STP or STP LMT as order type. Would only use stop for very liquid options with thight spreads though (SPY, GLD) as you will be filled at bid/offer - not fun if the spread is huge and you could trade near mid

Good point on the spread. I guess you'd have to use a stop limit? Even so, on an option spread is the stop going to be triggered on the bid/ask midpoint?

[Marco]

>> Good point on the spread. I guess you'd have to use a stop limit?

yes but than you have a good chance of your stop not being filled - I think stop orders with everything but super liquid stuff (SPY etc) are problematic - I don't use them

>> Even so, on an option spread is the stop going to be triggered on the bid/ask midpoint?

good question, it should be but I'd ask your broker to be sure.

[cwerdna]

Did something happen to/change with IB's combo charting? It seems recently it completely changed and it looks wonky compared how to used to look.

See attached. I hit the same thing the other day when the market was open and I think it "fixed" itself once the market closed.

Is there some option/default I need to change or is this a bug?

[Xfanman]

Did something happen to/change with IB's combo charting? It seems recently it completely changed and it looks wonky compared how to used to look.

See attached. I hit the same thing the other day when the market was open and I think it "fixed" itself once the market closed.

Is there some option/default I need to change or is this a bug?

This happens to me too sometime. It always corrects itself. Sometimes I open another chart to fix it, sometimes I have to restart the app and sometimes it just fixes itself. Go figure...

[cwerdna]

I have some US tax related questions related to IB. I use Turbotax.

First off, I may be closing my account w/them soon. Do they still let you download tax info after you've closed your account? From http://www.interacti...youraccount.htm, it looks like it but it's unclear what the limited time is.

Does IB provide free Gainskeeper calculations/access or something equivalent? I don't know how things are different now with 2011+ tax year changes (http://www.irs.gov/Tax-Professionals/Cost-Basis-Reporting-Overview-and-FAQs) where brokers have to report basis for securities acquired on/after 1/1/11. I didn't have an IB account for the 2011 tax year.

Basically, what I'm looking for is like what I have on TD Ameritrade/TOS. They had a 2 step (IIRC) process where you had to download the 1099 info for part of the info (1099-INT and DIV?) then there was another step where you could use free Gainskeeper and I think import what it produces into Turbotax (for stocks and options). So, there was very little work. (My memory on this is a little foggy since it's been than 8 months since I last worked on that.)

Does IB have something like this? I noticed they have the ability to generate Gainskeeper data files, but that seems to imply I need to pay for my own Gainskeeper subscription. http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/interactive-brokers-selects-gainskeeper-for-tax-lot-accounting-services-54323812.html isn't real helpful.

I'll probably send a message to their "wonderful" support tonight to ask as well.

[Kim]

IB id further reducing the cancellation fee, to $0.10.

[Xfanman]

IB id further reducing the cancellation fee, to $0.10.

Nice, now that they have that almost resolved they can get to work on PSE!

[Kelly Park]

Regarding PSE, I just sold two contracts on VXX, as part of the VXX income trade. Identical contracts and bids, one filled on CBOE2, the other on PSE. The commission on CBOE2 was 0.69 per contract, 1.51 per contract on PSE. Everything was the same about the contracts except the exchange.

[tjlocke99]

Does anyone know if there is anyway with Interactive brokers to have more than 4 legs in a spread?

For example if I want to close out a triple calendar is there any easy way to do this without legging out?

Thanks.

[Guest listolyman]

I think that you can only close out 2 of the 3 calendars in a single trade and then the other calendar solo. I have found recently that the prices are better if you trade each calendar separately.

[jr1221]

I can't seem to find a way to set an alert for a combo in IB. Are alerts only allowed for singles? I see I can set an alarm, but that appears to only come up on the desktop and not send you an email. Thanks if anyoen knows.