unkybill 2 Report post Posted September 22, 2015 OMG!!! I joined yesterday (yup, a real newbie) and took the SPX butterfly put trade, but on PAPER (RATS!!!!), as recommended. I didn't get the fill yesterday, so I made it a GTC order, which went off at 9:33 this AM. The "first-hour crazies" were all over the puts, so instead of paying $7.50 for the spread, as recommended, my account was CREDITED for $24.70 per share!!! My problem now is, despite placing asking prices throughout the day from $8.00 to $9.00 (as recommended) to sell the spread, and seeing the spread priced at levels at and around my asking prices all day long, I can't get anybody to buy it. I thought SPX was really liquid. Anybody have any comments that would help? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin 63 Report post Posted September 22, 2015 OMG!!! I joined yesterday (yup, a real newbie) and took the SPX butterfly put trade, but on PAPER (RATS!!!!), as recommended. I didn't get the fill yesterday, so I made it a GTC order, which went off at 9:33 this AM. The "first-hour crazies" were all over the puts, so instead of paying $7.50 for the spread, as recommended, my account was CREDITED for $24.70 per share!!! My problem now is, despite placing asking prices throughout the day from $8.00 to $9.00 (as recommended) to sell the spread, and seeing the spread priced at levels at and around my asking prices all day long, I can't get anybody to buy it. I thought SPX was really liquid. Anybody have any comments that would help? Are you sure you entered in the trade properly for the right strikes and the right expiration? It was a debit trade to open, not a credit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
unkybill 2 Report post Posted September 22, 2015 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Bought 5 SPX Nov-06-15 2150 call (SPXWK0615B215000) @ $.40 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Bought 5 SPX Oct-23-15 2000 put (SPXWV2315B200000) @ $54.10 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Sold 10 SPX Oct-23-15 1950 put (SPXWV2315B195000) @ $49.70 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Bought 5 SPX Oct-23-15 1900 put (SPXWV2315B190000) @ $20.60 Thanx, Mr. Edboc, for your interest. This is a partial copy (I left out the fees and commissions) as presented by OptionsHouse in their paper trading account. I ran this through my calculator, and I get a a $12,350.00 credit. Any thoughts? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
unkybill 2 Report post Posted September 22, 2015 I forgot to account for the call. The net would have been reduced to $10,350. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kim 7,943 Report post Posted September 22, 2015 Those prices don't make sense. Please double check. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin 63 Report post Posted September 23, 2015 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Bought 5 SPX Nov-06-15 2150 call (SPXWK0615B215000) @ $.40 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Bought 5 SPX Oct-23-15 2000 put (SPXWV2315B200000) @ $54.10 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Sold 10 SPX Oct-23-15 1950 put (SPXWV2315B195000) @ $49.70 09/22/15 09:33:48 Trade Bought 5 SPX Oct-23-15 1900 put (SPXWV2315B190000) @ $20.60 Thanx, Mr. Edboc, for your interest. This is a partial copy (I left out the fees and commissions) as presented by OptionsHouse in their paper trading account. I ran this through my calculator, and I get a a $12,350.00 credit. Any thoughts? The 2000 Oct-23-15 Puts didn't trade near 54 today, they traded at around 77 that time, and the 1900 put traded around 32 at that time this morning. The 2000 puts that expire this week traded at 54.10 today at that time, so that's probably the quote that OpionsHouse had in their paper trading system. The 1900 puts that expire for Oct2 weeklies (second expiration week) traded around 21 at that time. It sounds like their "paper" trading system had incorrect quotes that mixed up all of your expiration dates on two of your legs, and that's why your paper trade looks like a credit. I would bring this up with their support staff and ask them. Maybe they'll investigate it for you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
unkybill 2 Report post Posted September 23, 2015 Thanx for straightening this out. For a few minutes there, I thought I'd be a zillionaire. OH had screwed up another paper trade I'd done before joining SO. I will be in touch with them. Looking at their option tables tonight, it appears that there really isn't that much trading volume with these puts. I'm wondering whether or not there would be a problem filling a butterfly sell order like this one. Thanx again, Edboc! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin 63 Report post Posted September 23, 2015 SPX, VIX, SPY & AAPL trade the highest volume options products, they are liquid, getting filled shouldn't be hard. See the volume reports in the CBOE link below. http://www.cboe.com/data/monthlyvolume.aspx Equity Options Volume reports: http://www.cboe.com/data/avgdailyvolarchive.aspx Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pintodave 86 Report post Posted September 23, 2015 I'd be curious as to what their explanation is too. My guess is that since it is a paper account, maybe you got some mythical first print fill that wouldn't have happened in reality? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
unkybill 2 Report post Posted September 23, 2015 Hi, everybody! Thanx for all your very constructive help in bringing me back to reality!!! I chatted with OH this AM and learned a lot! Here's the transcript: Becky W: Thank you for chatting, how can I help you today?William : I've run a couple of trades in my "paper" account lately and it appears that there were some errors. First trade ended with a small profit on a SPY butterfly, but the account says that all options expired worthless--not true. Second (most recent) trade seems to have used the wrong values when I opened the trade, showing a credit on a butterfly spread that should have been a debit. Please advise. There would be no sense in using this account if it is not accurate. Becky W: there can be limitations to the paper trading platform especially with advanced order tickets, it is just a practice paltform.Becky W: the market will not reflect exactly as the real market placeWilliam: So, in essence, what you're saying is that if I want to experiment with some ideas, don't use the paper account; use excel?Becky W: I am saying paper may have limitations and if you are looking for an exact mock of the mkt please take that into consideration Lesson well learned! Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwin 63 Report post Posted September 23, 2015 Hi, everybody! Thanx for all your very constructive help in bringing me back to reality!!! I chatted with OH this AM and learned a lot! Here's the transcript: Becky W: Thank you for chatting, how can I help you today? William : I've run a couple of trades in my "paper" account lately and it appears that there were some errors. First trade ended with a small profit on a SPY butterfly, but the account says that all options expired worthless--not true. Second (most recent) trade seems to have used the wrong values when I opened the trade, showing a credit on a butterfly spread that should have been a debit. Please advise. There would be no sense in using this account if it is not accurate. Becky W: there can be limitations to the paper trading platform especially with advanced order tickets, it is just a practice paltform. Becky W: the market will not reflect exactly as the real market place William: So, in essence, what you're saying is that if I want to experiment with some ideas, don't use the paper account; use excel? Becky W: I am saying paper may have limitations and if you are looking for an exact mock of the mkt please take that into consideration Lesson well learned! Bill Good to know. Maybe try thinkorswim paper trading. I don't recall if you have to put in money into an account to paper trade with it. I think the quotes are delayed unless you have a real account. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cgw777 0 Report post Posted September 24, 2015 Kim- For some reason I didn't get the closing update on this trade in my email. I did however get the opening post and I did get the closing post on the LULU trade recently. Do you know why I wouldn't have received the update on this (Oct SPX butterfly) trade? Thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kim 7,943 Report post Posted September 24, 2015 You don't follow the topics. You need to follow the topics to get the adjustment and closing alerts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
